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WARNING - NYS DOT Pulling Over Horse Trailers Email from George King, NYSHC Folks, The DOT arguments have reared their ugly heads again and we need to be prepared. For those that have not encountered this before, the message below will give you and idea. If they are pulling you over for safety infractions and for inspection, that is on you. If you have not had your trailer inspected for this year, then I would recommend it. If you do not know how to hook up your trailer properly, I would recommend checking with DOT. As for the need for a CDL or a DOT number, I have included the documents that we obtained previously when this became an issue. "You do not need a DOT number when you are going to shows for hobby reasons. If you are a business in any way, you had better have a DOT #." Just for the record, racing people are businesses and in no way can a race meet be equated to a horse show. My recommendation, as it was before, is to carry a copy of the above documents with you when you travel to shows. And please hook up your trailers properly. Geo ----- CDL Requirements for Horse Trailers
Recently we received the following message: "I just heard that NYS is trying to pass a law that all horse truck and trailer drivers are going to need a CDL to drive with. Have you heard anything on this as it would crush the industry even more for people who go to the shows in our state and those who are hauling from other states." We promptly sent a message to DOT, the 2 Ag Committees (contacts that I normally work with) and to the FB. The following is the situation as it stands today: There is no change to the regulation concerning the requirement for a CDL license, and to DOT's knowledge, none in the planning stage. I have attached the two answers I have received (one from DOT and one from FB) which say basically the same thing. That this is probably an outgrowth of the requirement for vehicles over 10,000 lbs to obtain a DOT number. We have addressed that requirement in other communications; emails, the newsletter, the Country Folks newspaper and other pubs. So what is the regulation. Without going into all the various items in the DOT and FB messages, it is that if your truck and trailer combined have a GVWR of over 26,000 lbs then you need a CDL license or if your trailer weighs more than 10,000 lbs. The table below looks at the most common combinations. You can look at your own situation by using the table or by looking up the GVWR of your truck and trailer combination. But to make a long story short, unless you are hauling using a truck larger than 1 ton and a trailer with more than four horses or a monstrous 3-4 horse with living quarters, you do not have to worry and are not required to obtain a CDL license.
ANSWER FROM NEW YORK STATE DOT 2 FEBRUARY 2007 Attached are the current requirements: A CDL is required when the GVWR of the trailer being pulled is greater than 10,000 lbs and the combination GVWR of the truck and trailer is greater than 26,000 lbs. I have not heard of any proposed changes.
Bob Montgomery ITS1 NYS Department of Transportation 50 Wolf Road, POD 53 Albany NY 12232 Tel (518) 485-7770 www.nysdot.gov/portal/page/portal/divisions/operating/osss/truck
ANSWER FROM THE NEW YORK STATE FARM BUREAU 2 FEBRUARY 2007 Good Afternoon George, We've received several questions on this general issue from horse owners and I wanted to just provide you with some information that will hopefully clarify where we are at with the licensing issue. The short answer to your member's question is that we at NYFB are not aware of any proposed changes to the existing CDL requirements. What I think what we are actually dealing with is a concern in the industry about the existing regulations.
Briefly, the reason this has become an issue is because of the new regulations that have been phased in over the past two years requiring the labeling of all Commercial Motor Vehicles (CMVs). Under the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration (FMCSA) regulations, which NYS has adopted, a commercial vehicle is considered any vehicle involved in a commercial enterprise whose gross combined weight exceeds 10,000 pounds. Since a pick-up truck and horse trailer or livestock trailer quickly exceed 10,000 pounds, almost all farms except those that own horses and livestock merely for hobby, are covered by the regulations. While this size vehicle has been covered by the FMCSA regulations and all of the accompanying requirements for quite some time, it has only recently come to the attention of the industry due to the new marking requirements. Part of this attention to the regulations has focused the industry on the current CDL requirements as well. As a general rule, all vehicles or combination of vehicles that exceed 26,000 pounds can only be driven with a CDL. Vehicles under that weight can be operated without a CDL. NYS DMV has put together a chart which lays this out. It can be found at: http://www.nydmv.state.ny.us/forms/mv500c.pdf I know the chart can be a little confusing. My understanding of this is that: " If a farmer drives a combination of vehicles that are over 26,000 pounds and the trailer carries or is registered to carry 10,001 pounds or more, the farmer needs either a class A CDL or an F endorsement on their existing license (see below). " If a farmer drives a straight truck that weighs more than 26,000 or drives a truck/trailer combination over 26,000 lbs where the trailer is less than 10,000 pounds, the farmers needs either a Class B CDL or a G endorsement on their existing license. " The F and G endorsements are used to provide farmers some flexibility. If a farmer has an endorsement, they are allowed to drive the respective vehicle class within 150 miles of the farm. Beyond that radius, the farmer must have a CDL to drive the vehicle. Acquiring an endorsement requires that the farmer take a potion of the CDL written test and take a driving test with a representative vehicle. " To make things even more confusing-while the law technically says that the normal everyday license that we all have (Class D) can have the endorsement placed on it, DMV has not yet had time to implement the law. What this means is that farms filing for an F or G endorsement will technically receive an upgrade to a Non-CDL-C license with their endorsements. This license category doesn't add to requirements, it simply adds to the confusion. I know that the horse sector, more than any other part of agriculture, has folks who are involved in the industry solely for enjoyment. I did inquire with DMV as to how large campers, for example, that exceed 26,000 pounds are handled. Much like agriculture, large camper drivers have an exemption as well from the CDL requirements through an endorsement process. Their endorsement however has no specific mileage limit here in New York. Where does this all leave us? As you can see, we have a set series of regulations that we need to be complying with at this point in time. I share your concern about the overall cost of compliance to the industry and recognize that this not only impacts horse owners, but livestock owners across the state. I truly believe that agriculture does not fit well into the FMCSA regulations and that while certain exemptions have been provided for farms, the regulations still do not recognize the unique transportation needs of agriculture. While NY has adopted the FMCSA regulations, my understanding is that through legislative changes, specific state exemptions could be provided. Now the counter argument for any exemption we propose will be the impact on highway safety from changing the existing program-I don't know that these are actually that valid. Also, I should point out that any changes made by New York would only be valid here in New York and not extend beyond the state-line. In general, I would think exempting vehicles involved in agricultural transportation under 26,000 from the definition of commercial motor vehicle, removing the requirement that "farm plated" vehicles over 26,000 pounds be marked with US DOT numbers and expanding the F & G endorsements state-wide would be some possible policy solutions to alleviate the burden on all of agriculture. We already have existing policy on the expansion of the F & G endorsements and marking issues for farm plated vehicles. We can start drafting legislation and looking at ways to incorporate it into the legislative session. I should say that I was actually very surprised that we didn't have new policy established on livestock trailers at all during annual meeting. This may be something that should be considered for Policy Development or in the interim, by the Board. Please let me know if you have any questions. Hope the day is going well, John Tauzel NYFB
TABLE OF GVW AND TRAILER WEIGHT COMBINATIONS TOW VEHICLE AND TRAILER COMBINATIONS
GVWR'S FOR PICKUPS (CHEVY USED FOR ILLUSTRATION)
1500 SERIES (Known as ½ ton) 7000 lbs 2500 SERIES (Known as 3/4 ton) 8600 lbs 3500 SERIES (Known as 1 ton) 11,400 lbs
TRAILER WEIGHTS The weights shown here are from Double D Trailers in North Carolina. I use them because the trailer they make is made of steel and are heavyweight trailers. I also have used the tack room style or living quarters style because they are the heaviest. If someone is using a pure stock trailer, it will be lighter in weight.
2 Horse Trailer with Tack Room 4400 lbs 3 Horse Trailer with Tack Room5100 lbs 4 Horse Trailer with Tack Room5500 lbs 3 Horse Trailer with Living Quarters *11,500 lbs *This is a monster, fully equipped.
Combination weights Normal situation. 2500 Pickup plus 3 horse trailer plus 3 horses 8600 + 5100 + 3300 = 17,000 lbs
Extreme Case 3500 Pickup plus 3 horse with LQ plus 3 horses 11,400 + 11,500 + 3300 = 26,200
Dear Mr. King,
New York State has adopted Part 390.3 into our regulations including the cited interpretation. You are correct that as long as the underlying activities were not undertaken for profit and prize money earned in the show would be required to be filed as ordinary income, and not deducted as a business expense, then the activity is not considered commerce. It doesn't matter if someone transports another persons horse to a show if it is hobby related. If you have the name of the NYSDOT speaker, please let me know so that I can clarify this with him.
Thank you,
Bob Montgomery ITS1 NYS Department of Transportation 50 Wolf Road, POD 53 Albany NY 12232
Name: George W. King Address: 44 Eggleston Lane Westport, NY 12993 518-962-2316
E-Mail: kinggeo@westelcom.com Comments: Gentlemen, I am the President of the New York State Horse Council and have been inundated by numerous queries concerning the applicability of the new requirement to individual horse owners trailering their horses. A large majority of the horse owners in the state are backyard horse owners or private horse owners who show or perform other functions as a hobby. Since they are not commercial enterprises, we checked the federal regs to see if they apply. We found the following information: FMCSA GENERAL REGULATION 390 §390.3 General applicability. (f) Exceptions. Unless otherwise specifically provided, the rules in this subchapter do not apply to - f)(3) The occasional transportation of personal property by individuals not for compensation nor in the furtherance of a commercial enterprise;
Interpretation for Part 390: General Question 21: Does the exemption in §390.3(f)(3) for the "occasional transportation of personal property by individuals not for compensation nor in the furtherance of a commercial enterprise" apply to persons who occasionally use CMVs to transport cars, boats, horses, etc., to races, tournaments, shows or similar events, even if prize money is offered at these events? Guidance: The exemption would apply to this kind of transportation, provided: (1) The underlying activities are not undertaken for profit, i.e., (a) prize money is declared as ordinary income for tax purposes, and (b) the cost of the underlying activities is not deducted as a business expense for tax purposes; and, where relevant; (2) corporate sponsorship is not involved. Drivers must confer with their State of licensure to determine the licensing provisions to which they are subject. But as late as last night a member of your staff made a presentation with the following information, "I attended the meeting with the NY DOT guy last night. It was informative but very confusing. He had people in all kinds of business there, so each group had a different set of regulations. Basically he told us that if we transport our own horse to a show where there is a prize paid in money, we need to get the number. But if we transport our own horse as well as a friend's horse, then we are a business. Even if we don't get paid for transporting the friends horse, either within the state or across state line." Your own documentation states that this action is to bring New York in compliance with the federal requirements and that it applys to trucks and trailers used for business with an asterisk that says "trucks used strictly for personal use do not need a US DOT#. We need clarification of this point for our 20,000 members. Do we follow the federal regs or is there a different interpretation in the state of New York? Thanking you in advance for your assistance. George W. King
TOW VEHICLE AND TRAILER COMBINATIONS
GVWR'S FOR PICKUPS (CHEVY USED FOR ILLUSTRATION)
1500 SERIES (Known as ½ ton) 7000 lbs 2500 SERIES (Known as 3/4 ton) 8600 lbs 3500 SERIES (Known as 1 ton) 11,400 lbs
TRAILER WEIGHTS The weights shown here are from Double D Trailers in North Carolina. I use them because the trailer they make is made of steel and are heavyweight trailers. I also have used the tack room style or living quarters style because they are the heaviest. If someone is using a pure stock trailer, it will be lighter in weight.
2 Horse Trailer with Tack Room 4400 lbs 3 Horse Trailer with Tack Room5100 lbs 4 Horse Trailer with Tack Room5500 lbs 3 Horse Trailer with Living Quarters *11,500 lbs
*This is a monster, fully equipped.
Combination weights
Normal situation. 2500 Pickup plus 3 horse trailer plus 3 horses 8600 + 5100 + 3300 = 17,000 lbs
Extreme Case
3500 Pickup plus 3 horse with LQ plus 3 horses 11,400 + 11,500 + 3300 = 26,200
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